Simms Going Direct

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Fishmaster Flex
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Re: Simms Going Direct

Post by Fishmaster Flex » Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:24 pm

Works fine for Patagonia.
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DeadRatsClacker
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Re: Simms Going Direct

Post by DeadRatsClacker » Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:35 pm

I could go and get all pissed over this but seriously under the type of program they are putting in today, I think it will be a minor deal I mean Patagucci Whorvis Redington all sell direct, so do a bunch of outdoor companies, remember Cloudveil?

Funnily enough I do see some positiives, ie Simms now slashes inventory through the winterand I have a pain in the ass trying to keep waders stocked Nov-Feb, as we have a year round fishery, and Simms operates on the Rocky Mountain calender.

They are promises better inventory, and guaranteed inventory for guys like me ahead of their own store. I pointed this out quite strongly and promised to hold their balls over a fire if they dont hold up their end.

Simms has a reputation as beign hard to deal with, which is true if you are a whiney bitch who wants it all your own way. On the other hand if you recognise Simms are just doing everything they can to be as successful as they can be, and you go for the ride work their system, their products are very good and sell well, and they actually freaking listen.

we and a bunch of other dealers had been talkign about the narrowness of the legs on big ole southern boys so we got a fuller cut wader this year. Apparently bugger all dealers ordered them (we did) so guys will go to simms to order pay tax, shipping etc or come to guys like me.

The challenge for the guys like me is to get better at buying what the customer wants.
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lownslow
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Re: Simms Going Direct

Post by lownslow » Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:54 pm

DRC that's a constant struggle in retail and I feel your pain. There are no crystal balls. I think the majority of the people in this tiny market understand the importance of buying from a local shop. or any shop, for that matter. If they didn't they'd all buy Simms waders from Cabelas. People want these products and they will shop locally for them regardless of whether or not simms sells direct.

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InTheDrift
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Re: Simms Going Direct

Post by InTheDrift » Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:04 pm

Fishmaster Flex wrote:Works fine for Patagonia.
That's what I thought right away.

Whether this passes or fails will be determined by how Simms treats its retailers. If retailers are ordering items only to be told they are backordered, and then finding them in the direct online store, then there might be problems.

Then again, who are the retailers gonna go to? Simms is a giant when it comes to marketing and they produce a pretty damn good product.

I have no idea what kind of coals you have to walk over to deal Simms or Patagonia, but you can't burn bridges or forget your roots. It'll bite you in the ass in the end...bass crowd or not. And fuck that by the way. Fucking tournament jerseys? Really?

What happened between them and Muck?

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BigCliff
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Re: Simms Going Direct

Post by BigCliff » Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:28 pm

InTheDrift wrote:Whether this passes or fails will be determined by how Simms treats its retailers. If retailers are ordering items only to be told they are backordered, and then finding them in the direct online store, then there might be problems.
I agree that how that situation is handled will be key.

Given that they're only going to sell at full retail + tax + shipping, I really don't think they're going to take lots of sales from local dealers where folks can try stuff on. But that doesn't mean they're not gonna piss off some dealers that don't see it like I do.
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SIXGUNNER
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Re: Simms Going Direct

Post by SIXGUNNER » Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:51 pm

IF they stick to selling at full retail I think it will be a complete non-issue. But I think the temptation to dump over runs and old inventory may be too much of a good thing for them not to do. They already send out seasonal specials to every person signed up for prodeals that allows people to buy for others not on the approved proform list from select merchandise.

Its just the next step and inevitable..

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Spudnik
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Re: Simms Going Direct

Post by Spudnik » Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:33 pm

BigCliff wrote:
InTheDrift wrote:Whether this passes or fails will be determined by how Simms treats its retailers. If retailers are ordering items only to be told they are backordered, and then finding them in the direct online store, then there might be problems.
I agree that how that situation is handled will be key.

Given that they're only going to sell at full retail + tax + shipping, I really don't think they're going to take lots of sales from local dealers where folks can try stuff on. But that doesn't mean they're not gonna piss off some dealers that don't see it like I do.
Hah you're a hoot. What about destination shops? Someone like yourself comes in, tries on a Large King and an XL short, both don't fit, they go home an order an XL King from Simms. Retailers have a hard enough time keeping $700 products in stock indefinitely, now they're forced to keep entire lines in stock so they don't lose sales to Simms direct. It's tough, especially for smaller shops. As always, those are the ones that are going to be hurt the most. Simms is effectively trying to get retailers to carry full lines of products, order way more on preseasons (which helps Simms gauge mfg immensely), and is going to force its smaller dealers to buy more Simms, thereby lessening their inventory of other things, like rods and lines. Tough situation for the little guys.



Best thing to come out of this is getting Simms products out of Amazon and EBay stores.
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ak_powder_monkey
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Re: Simms Going Direct

Post by ak_powder_monkey » Fri Feb 17, 2012 12:50 am

haven't they had a bunch of web specials and shit for a little while now...
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Ginseng Sullivan
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Re: Simms Going Direct

Post by Ginseng Sullivan » Fri Feb 17, 2012 5:51 am

DRC- unless simms decides to hold back product from dealers so they can sell it direct at bigger profits...

btw i called this but was off by two years. i guess i just overestimated their ambition.

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steelhyde
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Re: Simms Going Direct

Post by steelhyde » Fri Feb 17, 2012 9:59 am

Ginseng Sullivan wrote:DRC- unless simms decides to hold back product from dealers so they can sell it direct at bigger profits...
Exactly.

The increase in revenue from selling direct will far outweigh the loss of product going to the dealer. They'll double the revenue on stuff they're selling direct with hardly any relationship to the consumer. Also, dont forget the sales reps that are losing out on sales commissions.

It's a sign of the times - this industry has been at a stalemate for too long and something had to give to keep companies growing. Simms and Redington have their eyes on big goals and the specialty fly fishing industry wont get them there. In the eyes of the consumer, this isnt a big deal. But Simms is without a doubt one of the biggest sources of revenues for shops and they are going to have a huge void to fill. Who is gonna fill it? I feel for the dealer on this one. They're being dumped like a high school girlfriend.

As for the Orvis and Patagonia argument, those companies were direct from day one. Simms was born out of the specialty dealer. You cant compare the two.

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DeadRatsClacker
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Re: Simms Going Direct

Post by DeadRatsClacker » Fri Feb 17, 2012 12:41 pm

Ginseng Sullivan wrote:DRC- unless simms decides to hold back product from dealers so they can sell it direct at bigger profits...

btw i called this but was off by two years. i guess i just overestimated their ambition.
Exactly the conversation I had with my rep, and received certain guarantees. this is the one area dealers need to hold their balls over a fire.

But really if I'm doing my job right, buying product, right sales training I dont think we will lose much and stand to gain some. If anyone loses a bunch, id be surprised, but its nice to have something to blame someone else for ....

BTW if any of you have seen the shipping charged by Simms to dealers, we aren't goign to be that uncompetitive.
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BigCliff
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Re: Simms Going Direct

Post by BigCliff » Fri Feb 17, 2012 4:02 pm

Spudnik wrote: Hah you're a hoot. What about destination shops? Someone like yourself comes in, tries on a Large King and an XL short, both don't fit, they go home an order an XL King from Simms.
Don't follow your logic. The fact that the guy didn't buy at that shop because they didn't have his size won't be changed by the fact that Simms site has them. He didn't buy something because they didn't have it.

Pretty weak long-winded attempt at a fat joke though. :coffee

The feet are too small for me on an LK, btw. You know what they say... :Roll Eyes
Buy better hooks and bourbon.

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