Can't pass the test then you can't vote...

User avatar
eponymous
Posts: 1503
Joined: Sat Oct 22, 2005 1:01 am
Location: The Hub

Re: Can't pass the test then you can't vote...

Post by eponymous » Thu Mar 24, 2011 5:10 pm

ditchdoc wrote:It seems to me that taking money out of tax returns would solve a buttload of problems.
Doesn't solve the problem of media. Be it support of left candidates on the traditional TV/Cable news outlets and newspapers or the right from talk radio or Fox.
"Baseball gives every American boy a chance to excel, not just to be as good as someone else but to be better than someone else. This is the nature of man and the name of the game." Ted Williams

User avatar
Rusty Hook
Posts: 3678
Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 1:01 am
Location: somewhere north of Boulder
Contact:

Re: Can't pass the test then you can't vote...

Post by Rusty Hook » Fri Mar 25, 2011 9:52 pm

eponymous wrote:
Plow wrote: Why do you always assume the poor and disenfranchised can't do shit like pass a simple test?
The soft bigotry of low expectations as some fella once said.
Nice try, guys. Here's what I actually said:
Rusty Hook wrote:Beyond that, how does knowing how many members are in the House of Representatives or how many amendments there are to the Constitution have any effect on whether a person is able to choose who they want to represent them? It still looks to me like a slick and not even an original way to keep certain people, usually the poor and disenfranchised, from voting, which is why this tactic was made illegal more than 40 years ago.
Instead of explaining why you find it so important to make voting more difficult, you ignore the history of literacy tests and don't even bother to defend your position that the questions on that test have any relevance to a citizen's ability to choose their own leaders?
Looking at my quote< I don't see any assumption that "the poor and disenfranchised can't do shit like pass a simple test," let alone "always" assuming that. Not that it is any surprise; you don't have an honest bone in your body.
The virtues are lost in self-interest as rivers are lost in the sea.
-- Franklin D. Roosevelt

Image

User avatar
canook
Posts: 954
Joined: Sat Mar 05, 2011 5:14 pm
Location: Further

Re: Can't pass the test then you can't vote...

Post by canook » Sat Mar 26, 2011 7:28 am

Plow wrote:
Don't like the donation via tax returns. If a candidate can't raise funds he shouldn't be running.
What does fund-raising ability have to do with being a competent legislator? You're looking for political candidates that are good at separating people from their money?

User avatar
Plow
Posts: 5059
Joined: Sun Dec 10, 2006 1:01 am
Location: Deep South Everywhere

Re: Can't pass the test then you can't vote...

Post by Plow » Sat Mar 26, 2011 8:08 am

canook wrote:
Plow wrote:
Don't like the donation via tax returns. If a candidate can't raise funds he shouldn't be running.
What does fund-raising ability have to do with being a competent legislator? You're looking for political candidates that are good at separating people from their money?
Competent legislators should be in the Congress. Leaders should be in the White House. If a candidate can't put together fund raising and inspire donations then he's not much of a manager/leader.

Tax is a bad idea because I don't want the government deciding who can run and I don't want to be forced to donate.
Better Reds than dead...

User avatar
peetso
Posts: 1723
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2011 11:44 am
Location: the edge of the Great Northern Muskeg
Contact:

Re: Can't pass the test then you can't vote...

Post by peetso » Sat Mar 26, 2011 11:59 am

Plow wrote: Competent legislators should be in the Congress. Leaders should be in the White House. If a candidate can't put together fund raising and inspire donations then he's not much of a manager/leader.

Tax is a bad idea because I don't want the government deciding who can run and I don't want to be forced to donate.
As long as only individuals can contribute to the funds and at a capped/maximum value, then I don't disagree with this.

But when corporations, unions, lobby groups, industry, etc. are allowed to donate and start giving vast sums of money then politicians/managers/leaders become indebted to these special interest groups.

Influence shouldn't be able to bought by those with cash and government should be accountable to individual citizens only, not special interests.
"Cheer up. You are not on fire." - jhnnythndr

the borealist

User avatar
canook
Posts: 954
Joined: Sat Mar 05, 2011 5:14 pm
Location: Further

Re: Can't pass the test then you can't vote...

Post by canook » Sat Mar 26, 2011 3:28 pm

Plow wrote: If a candidate can't put together fund raising and inspire donations then he's not much of a manager/leader.
So, to paraphrase, you're saying the ability to separate a person from their money is a positive attribute in a politician.

User avatar
Plow
Posts: 5059
Joined: Sun Dec 10, 2006 1:01 am
Location: Deep South Everywhere

Re: Can't pass the test then you can't vote...

Post by Plow » Sat Mar 26, 2011 4:08 pm

canook wrote:
Plow wrote: If a candidate can't put together fund raising and inspire donations then he's not much of a manager/leader.
So, to paraphrase, you're saying the ability to separate a person from their money is a positive attribute in a politician.
Is freewill involved? If so then its not the politician separating you from your money.
Better Reds than dead...

User avatar
canook
Posts: 954
Joined: Sat Mar 05, 2011 5:14 pm
Location: Further

Re: Can't pass the test then you can't vote...

Post by canook » Sat Mar 26, 2011 5:05 pm

Plow wrote:
canook wrote:
Plow wrote: If a candidate can't put together fund raising and inspire donations then he's not much of a manager/leader.
So, to paraphrase, you're saying the ability to separate a person from their money is a positive attribute in a politician.
Is freewill involved? If so then its not the politician separating you from your money.
History has taught us time and again and again that people can be convinced to separate themselves willingly from their money for the thinnest of reasons by preying on people's desires, beliefs, fears and weaknesses. Flim-flam men, con men, snake-oil salesmen, carpetbaggers, grifters, manager/leaders. Call them what you wish. Hardly a desirable trait.

User avatar
Plow
Posts: 5059
Joined: Sun Dec 10, 2006 1:01 am
Location: Deep South Everywhere

Re: Can't pass the test then you can't vote...

Post by Plow » Sat Mar 26, 2011 6:20 pm

canook wrote:History has taught us time and again and again that people can be convinced to separate themselves willingly from their money for the thinnest of reasons by preying on people's desires, beliefs, fears and weaknesses. Flim-flam men, con men, snake-oil salesmen, carpetbaggers, grifters, manager/leaders. Call them what you wish. Hardly a desirable trait.

Scamming people is a bad trait but what's that got to do with political donations? You trying to say Obama is a flim-flam man?
Better Reds than dead...

User avatar
canook
Posts: 954
Joined: Sat Mar 05, 2011 5:14 pm
Location: Further

Re: Can't pass the test then you can't vote...

Post by canook » Sat Mar 26, 2011 7:20 pm

Plow wrote:
canook wrote:History has taught us time and again and again that people can be convinced to separate themselves willingly from their money for the thinnest of reasons by preying on people's desires, beliefs, fears and weaknesses. Flim-flam men, con men, snake-oil salesmen, carpetbaggers, grifters, manager/leaders. Call them what you wish. Hardly a desirable trait.

Scamming people is a bad trait but what's that got to do with political donations? You trying to say Obama is a flim-flam man?
Absolutely he is (see below), along with Bush, Cheney, Harper (Canada) etc etc etc. I'm an equal-opportunity cynic. They all deceive to attain and hang on to power by the basest of methods, whether it be by instilling fear of the big bad godless commies, Saddam's non-existent wmd's and terrorist-training camps or the unkept promise to close the reprehensible Gitmo prison camp.

Obama's embarrassing ska album rediscovered
Obamas-Embarassing-R_jpg_630x1200_upscale_q85.jpg
Obamas-Embarassing-R_jpg_630x1200_upscale_q85.jpg (62.68 KiB) Viewed 403 times

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 9 guests