kind of self-explanatory, right? We seem to have some impressive thread-wrappers that lurk around this board. let's try to keep your "first booger" posts at a minimum.
User avatar
By BearsFan
#428047
JoshO wrote:I took a shot at it.

Image

Image
Pretty sure Fishlore gave me something like that in NOLA a few years back, had the most fish throwinist hook ever. Joke was on me...
User avatar
By SA Guy
#428062
CharlieJenkem wrote:I'll be tying either a huge mushmouth or a blue/white version of this thing:
http://www.guidepics.com/index.php?opti ... &Itemid=11

Hook will be a gamakatsu sl 12 in 6/0
That is the bizz, and The Guides company is also great. Paul, Arno and Francois knows how to catch GT's. Paul once told me around the fire of 82 GT's in a week in the Seychelles, I think 7 clients, can't remember exactly.
By Articulated Trico
#428131
Image
This is something I grabbed from a box and not necessarily what will be tyed. When I tie a fly for any species I try and vision a scenerio of how it will all go down. See it or envision me catching "that fish." The where's, when's, how's and most of all the limiting factors as to what will be my limits with a fly rod! My scenerio is seeing a GT will be either a crusing fish or a hot hunting fish. Cruising fish being able to deliver a fly leading them at 30 to 110 feet, putting it in there field of vision, then swimming my fly so it looks like something that triggers " i need to get that thing in my mouth!" Or similar to a pack of jack crevalle where they see and hear everything and will in turn eat anything they can fit in there mouth, when in the mood.

So I am thinking of making a cast in knee to hip deep water or moving boat. A fly that can be cast fast and far. Able to pick up, lay down shooting line and fly quicker with precision. My thought is a fly that is surface oriented or mid level. Maybe pushes some water creating some noise. For mid level I might shoot it with an intermediate line? Not sure if I will mix in a moderate dumbell eyes for the opportunity to drop the fly and let them see it come off the bottom. Although from the GT's I have seen they seem to move fast and look straight ahead! The Owner Aki's are a good choice but more 2/0 or 3/0 at best. I think testosterone is getting the better of the hook size. Think about it a mid size tarpon has a much larger mouth and very hard mouth. Plus a tarpon jumps multiple times, these fish just go like hell. Who fishes a 6/0 these days for poons? I want a strong hook that will set and hold from the fishes mass and coming tight on it.

Charlie I am thinking of something like the white bunny fly I sent you. Minus the second hook and bunny! More mass less weight equals happy accurate loops!
User avatar
By SLSS
#428136
Nice AT. That's what I'd like to hear more about- the problem to be solved. Any of you guys who've had a chance at these or similar, I'd love to hear your thoughts.

Right now I'm thinking of something mid level, slower sinking. A lot of what I've looked at on line has been strong colors, which surprised me. Is "matching the hatch" not particularly significant?
User avatar
By blumpkin
#428145
This is turning into a kick ass swap, stories, strategies
discussions and debates are highly encouraged.

Thanks for that AT!!!

The 6/0 stuff could come in handy
for gaffing pirates in the Seychelles.
User avatar
By SA Guy
#428156
Articulated Trico wrote:Image
This is something I grabbed from a box and not necessarily what will be tyed. When I tie a fly for any species I try and vision a scenerio of how it will all go down. See it or envision me catching "that fish." The where's, when's, how's and most of all the limiting factors as to what will be my limits with a fly rod! My scenerio is seeing a GT will be either a crusing fish or a hot hunting fish. Cruising fish being able to deliver a fly leading them at 30 to 110 feet, putting it in there field of vision, then swimming my fly so it looks like something that triggers " i need to get that thing in my mouth!" Or similar to a pack of jack crevalle where they see and hear everything and will in turn eat anything they can fit in there mouth, when in the mood.

So I am thinking of making a cast in knee to hip deep water or moving boat. A fly that can be cast fast and far. Able to pick up, lay down shooting line and fly quicker with precision. My thought is a fly that is surface oriented or mid level. Maybe pushes some water creating some noise. For mid level I might shoot it with an intermediate line? Not sure if I will mix in a moderate dumbell eyes for the opportunity to drop the fly and let them see it come off the bottom. Although from the GT's I have seen they seem to move fast and look straight ahead! The Owner Aki's are a good choice but more 2/0 or 3/0 at best. I think testosterone is getting the better of the hook size. Think about it a mid size tarpon has a much larger mouth and very hard mouth. Plus a tarpon jumps multiple times, these fish just go like hell. Who fishes a 6/0 these days for poons? I want a strong hook that will set and hold from the fishes mass and coming tight on it.

Charlie I am thinking of something like the white bunny fly I sent you. Minus the second hook and bunny! More mass less weight equals happy accurate loops!
This makes a lot of sense AT (Nice fly that) I've only chased them in the Seychelles and the Mozambique channel. The Seychelles flats is pretty much just as you discribed it from my experience. You don't need much else than a floating line there. The fly just needs to drop 10 inches bellow the surface and its game on. I remeber one particular GT that was just cruising in a litle channel on the flats, I got a good cast in with a whistler, when the fly started to move the GT imediately changed it's relaxed mode to an agresive hunter and zoomed in on it and took it faster than I would want to admit. This was on the African Banks, so I was able to cast to this one from an elivated position, which gave me a good vantage point to see how it reacted. One other thing I saw on the flats is how often they will lie behind turtels, and then chase out from behind it once you cast in the direction of the turtle.

In the Mozambique channel there is a lot more structure and you want to get the fly down a bit in the strong currents, you need a slowish sinking rate for this. Scientific Anglers developed a fly line with Ufudu that sinks at the perfect speed. They gave the line a stronger breaking strength to help you in rocky areas to put more pressure on the fish and keep it out of the obstackles.

Well I guess it boils down to where you will be targeting them, if it's the flats AT's logic is sound. If it's deeper structured water, like from the Bassas da India reefs, you want something that sinks a bit more and in deep water you want something like a Mega clouser with heavy dumbels.
User avatar
By CharlieJenkem
#428209
You make some good points AT (and that bunny fly was awesome btw). Love your analytical approach to these swaps :cool
6/0 did seem pretty big and not very much fun to cast, even with the 12wt you need to fight the thins... For shits and giggles I looked at my hooks:
hooks.JPG
hooks.JPG (149.13 KiB) Viewed 1036 times
There's a 6/0 Gamakatsu sl12s, a 3/0 Tiemco 6oosp, and a 1/0 Owner Aki. Look how close the 6/0 and 3/0 are in size (particularly gape) :bullshit

Anyhow, I'll dial it back to 4/0 in the gamakatsu.
User avatar
By Fishlore
#428211
Your spot on AT, I've got 5\0's on the way but have already started some stuff on 3\0's. Tarpon flies in the keys get smaller each year. Even a majority of the big trout we catch in our mtns are caught on size 20 midges. I know theres plenty of fish play goin on with a smaller hook. But an owner 3\0 or even the gami sc12 2\0-3\0 are both very stout hooks.

Good info from everyone fer shure. :cool
User avatar
By BearsFan
#428217
I have never throw a fly at a GT. I will admit to being clueless on to how these fish behave. I based selection on a recommendation from a pro who runs a top notch outfitter and targets these things to make his living. Direct quote,
On a full tide and while it's dropping, fish cruising slowly along rocky ledges and drop-offs are often looking for crabs. Sometimes these fish refuse baitfish patterns. My next step in the progression is a large crab pattern like a Cosmo Crab or Merkin in 6/0 0r 8/0. From time to time you'll get a fish that refuses both patterns, if we get another shot it often pays to change to a popper. I find a 6/0 Sliding Head Popper with Mylar or white usually works well.
I trust him and figured that many would tie baitfish patterns. Since I had no 8/0's sitting around I went with 6/0 and am sticking with it. Y'all are going soft in your old age, harden up!
User avatar
By blumpkin
#428224
Exposing even more excellent wisdom on these great fish.

Wish I had the troubleshooting skills that outfitter has,
I would just keep hucking clousers till I got an eat.
User avatar
By SA Guy
#429501
I've been playing around a bit, this is what I think I will be using and the thought process behind it:

I want as many triggers as possible in my flies, so the lateral line, eyes, flash, movement, vibrations and colouring is important to me. I will probably use a hook that is not chemically sharpened, as I like to be able to resharpen a hook if it goes blunt. All the materials should be durable, so I'm not going to use any natural materials.

A head that pushes water, yet looks realistic. Nothing better than a good brush head, made with stainless steel wire for durability. I think the colour is also good for a general bait fish imitation.
Picture1.jpg
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Big eyes that acts as a trigger and that vibrates a bit.
Picture7.jpg
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Ad some movement.
Picture8.jpg
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Great colour to the belly.
Picture2.jpg
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A bit of see through in the middle of the body with some flash.
Picture4.jpg
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A prominent triggering lateral line.
Picture6.jpg
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Something above the lateral line with movement.
Picture5.jpg
Picture5.jpg (80.7 KiB) Viewed 896 times
Ad some colour on top.
Picture3.jpg
Picture3.jpg (101.87 KiB) Viewed 896 times
This is not final, but will probably be the ingredients. I will ad some lead to the hook, to make it swim correct and sink a tad faster, but keep it an easy fly to cast.

:cool
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